Rayzoon Technologies LLC

[paspallum]

Ralph
I have a Dual Athalon 2.8Ghz with one GIG of RAM.

Since getting DP#2 and the Snarepaks... I'm finding that complex patterns (and especially fills) in jamstix seem to make occasional sreeching, whirring and clicking sounds of a computer that is not handling the load.

This is with no plugins open or no action being taken by cubase except running Jamstix.

The Cubase CPU meter is only running at about 20%- and goes up to about 30 or 35% on a complex fill.

Now I know that the better quality we get and the more realistic the sample layers sound, the better it is... I don't want to turn off my X-samples or use the voice reduction... I want as much realism as possible.

I can fix the problem myself by lowering (or is it increasing) the latency on my soundcard... but sometimes I might want to use Jamstix with another plugin or VSti like BFD or Guitar RIG and be playing it all in 'real time' with my latency at it's lowest setting...

What I want to know is this:
Where is the 'strain' being put on my system? Surely an Athalon 2.8Ghz can cope with only Jamstix being played ... even at the lowest latency? (the CPU meter is not 'pegging out')

I have a Gig of RAM... would more ram...say half a GIG more or a whole GIG help the samples to playback at my lowest latency setting without these horrible artifacts of digital noise?

In the BFD manual they go to great lenghths to expalin how much CPU is used and how much RAm and how the Ram can be buffrered at differing levels... They expailn that BFD is very RAM dependant and because of the high number of samples streaming into BFD, they suggest a second drive to be installed that has only the BFD samples on it.

but I don't know how Jamstix 'delivers' its samples... would more RAM help? would a second drive help? What would be more efective with jamstix? A second drive or more RAM??

paspallum

[gregjazz]

What soundcard are you using?

I'm still on 512 mb of RAM and it handles Jamstix fine.

[paspallum]

I have a Hoontech DSP24 value card,

I run it at 44.1khz and 24 bits

It's sample (latency) goes from 1024 milliseconds right down to ,516 256, 128, 64 and 48 Mlliseconds (which is very low)

If I run it at 48 Mls... I can monitor from cubase practially with no audible latency...

If I monitor over 512 most audio clicls ands pops go away...

Buy sometimes I want to record in real time to jamstix recording my guitar throuhj Guitar RIG

Paspallum

Paspallum

[thomasross20]

What's your cache size?
Sounds like your computer's more than up to the job.
I don't hear any noises, though my CPU meter does go up to 30% at times... and I've got a stonking new dual core pc!!!

[timmyo]

sounds like poor audio driver performance to me - your CPU and RAM sound good. See if there is an updated one available maybe ?

Maybe you have alot of background processes running though ?

[ProfRhino]

hi Paspallum,
got some info for you, don't know if you will like it, though .
First, the facts.
JS including all paks is running perfectly here on my internet PC, an old trusty P4-2000 with XP SP2 (latest patches), 1GB RAM and a 5 Euro Terratec SB Clone with ASIO4ALL drivers. No need for optimising latency, though, since I use a POD 2 for practising, which goes into the line in of the soundcard.
All recording is done on my separate studio rig anyway.
BTW, all JS content is on the 1st HD (C partition) and I got a s*itload of background tools running 24/7, including a real time on access antivirus software, ZoneAlarm, VNC and Opera.
Second, conclusions.
It's relatively safe to assume that the following factors can't be responsible for your problem, since your specs are equal or better to mine :
- CPU, RAM and HD
- probably not any background processes (you reasonably can't get a much worse audio environment than on my machine here)
- so what's left is the soundcard and drivers, especially the low latency you want. Believe me, even my state of the art RME soundcard in a 100% streamlined DualCore rig is only so - so comfortable @ 128 ms, 64 ms no go.
1024 ms (my standard latency) gives me almost 30% more plugin power than 128.
Third, solutions.
- work @ higher latencies but with Direct Monitoring, everybody and his dog does, or use a hardware mixer for monitoring like I do.
Of course you'll lose the ability to record while hearing GR.
- get a hardware recording device, a cheap modeler or, better, a tube preamp which will give you a much better sound anyway imho.
- you can also use a DI box to split the guitar signal, DI into the soundcard (latency doesn't matter that way) and listen via anything (even a cheap practise amp will do) fed from the split output every DI has.
Put GR on the clean recorded track later.
Just some ideas assuming you haven't got defective hardware or a bad software glitch in your machine, ymmv, as always.
Feel free to ask back or PM me if you got some further questions.
Cheers, Rhino

[ProfRhino]

oh, I forgot, my previous post is referring to JS only, from what I hear, BFD can be quite a greedy little beast depending on what kit you load.
Cheers, Rhino

[paspallum]

Thanks ProfRhino
You words and time are appreciated...
I do usually monitor with my desk... and therefore need not worry about latency...

But after getting Guitar Rig2 (yes I have a POD... and Guitar Rig2 kicks a POD's thin, skinny little Butt!) My dream is to run my soundcard a 48 samples per second...so that I can play direct to GATRIG2 with jamstix playing...a ll from my PC with inaudable latency... the timing gets right.... but th eclicks, pops and whirrrs start happening on busy Jamstix beats even before I 'plugin' the Guitar-rig...

Thansk for yout help anyway!
Paspallum

[Ralph [RZ]]

Increasing voice reduction in the mapping tab will reduce CPU usage and not impair realism all that much, especially in a busy mix.

Watch your hard drive light, if it lights up a lot while your host is playing, it is time for more RAM.

Popping while just running Jamstix indicates a latency too low for the CPU to handle (use voice reduction). If the HD light is on too much then it's a RAM issue.
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[paspallum]

I don't think there is anything terribly wrong with my soundcard or drivers...although it could very well be? But I'm not going to go and spend $200 to $300 dollars just to 'find out' if it is my soundcard.

What I really want to know is...will more RAM help my Jamstix samples at lower latency settings? Does Jamstix rely on RAM or CPU...

That's waht I want to know

Paspallum

[Ralph [RZ]]

Could you send me a FXB of an arrangement that causes popping and tell me what average CPU usage you see with it in Cubase and at what latency the popping disappears?

Also, send me your jamstix.ini so I can duplicate things as close as possible.
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[rv67]

I'm waiting for your expertise, Ralph.

Paspallum, just to share a matter I'm familiar with...
Here is one other response from Ralph for the issue you encounter, take a look at http://rayzoon.com/v-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?p=8092&highlight=#8092

I'm dealing with the same config. Cubase SX3, CPU 2.2 GHz for XP SP2 and 1Gb RAM. And I can't decrease under 15 ms (which is ~ buffer 320) latency because of awful pops. And at this latency I begin to hear the short delay especially when I strongly play with my electroacoustic guitar.

I have no solution to solve it right now. I think my hard drive doesn't work when I play (no led).

But I've noticed 2 things :
- sometimes pops don't come at the beginning but they arrive a couple of seconds (or minutes) after. Perhaps does that mean that along the play, some data are not "flushed" but added into Jamstix memory without beeing erased after ?
- when you begin to hear clicks, you can be sure that all other tracks you record at the same time include also sound bugs.

don't know if that helps, but...
RV

[ProfRhino]

Paspallum,
I understand your problem a little better now, but do you really expect to be able to run JS, BFD and GR2 @ 64 samples (not ms, we both made the same mistake , but meant the correct thing) buffer ?
Those are three of the CPU heavier plugins around (JS not quite as much).
Check out this thread for some hardcore info, long, but VERY interesting :
http://forum.nuendo.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=8614&sid=95b169bb748b95f57b8c54a72df60b44
At 128 samples (3 ms) and below even the best machines money can buy start to struggle heavily.
BTW, can you confirm you set XP's processor scheduling to "background services" and UNchecked "lower latency" in SX's ASIO settings ?
If not, try those settings (reboot), they will improve your ASIO performance considerably.
Cheers, Rhino

[steve b]

Paspallum I have 1.5 gbs of ram amd athlon 3000 1.73 ghz along with an Emu 1820m xp sp2 and I'm getting similar problems that wern't there when I first got Jamstix.I'm updated to 1.5. I've tried using Guitar rig with Jamstix Jam recently, and got nowhere near cpu overload, but got strange sounds more along the lines of a compressor sucking.I used guitar rig in the past with Jamstix with great success,with the latency down as low as 2ms.I have background services checked,no internet running or firewalls enabled,system restore unchecked on my audio partition.The one comfort is your not alone and this will get solved.The forum and Zueni are fantastic support.
_________________
EMU 1820M user

[paspallum]

Guys
thank you very much for all your help.
I'll try these things...

where in XP do you go (from the start menu) to find processor scheduling to set to "background services"?? I've not seen this before.

And will turning off system restore give me a bit more 'power'? Where do you go to turn off system restore?

Paspallum