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mikeon_b4c
Jammer
Joined: 19 Feb 2021
Posts: 32
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 Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2022 6:24 am Post subject: |
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| d_steinschneider wrote: | Hi Mike,
Thanks for the more detailed reply, it gives me the overview I was wondering about. I know what you mean about not getting into the weeds drum wise. I'm going to re-read your threads to see what kind of suggestions you got for creating parts for covers.
I got tips from Ralph and Azimuth that were very different from what I expected such as this one from Ralph that helped me get a hammond trio swing beat:
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STYLE: Jazz Swing
- set 'Swing Ride' to 100%
- set 'Kick' to 0% Amount
- set 'Snare' to 0% Funk, 0% Power Range and 50% Amount
- BRAIN->Extract From Other Player: get 'Main Kick' from 'Custom Rock' style
PLAYER: Roger with preset 'Restrained'
In the accent tab, use 'Early One' to control the frequency of jazzy early downbeats (4+) and you probably will want to turn the tom accents down.
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That got me into playing with the "Brain" and Power Range to tone down the fills. |
I was reflecting on this and on the value of it. The trouble I find is that you could fiddle around a lot to make a discovery like that (and having made it, it can be useful for re-use on other similar projects). However, there might come a point where the time and frustration spent trying to get Jamstix to play what you have in mind might be significantly more that just 'hand painting' in midi notes what your own imagination is telling you. Just one example of this in my collection is 'The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down'. In this song I'm trying to capture Levon Helm's personality but to make my own decisions about what I want to play / drop in at various points. I really don't want any kind of AI patterning and I want to drop in random hits as I see them fitting with the vocal delivery etc. And would Jamstix every think to do the drum rolls where I've 'played' them. It could all be done in Jamstix I suppose, but I found 'hand painting' midi notes to be a lot more fruitful than I would have if using the Jamstix editing tools. So to me, its hard to beat 'hand painting' but it is very taxing and labour intensive. Where I love Jamstix is that if I want to get a job done quicker and am prepared to compromise a bit over giving up the lead on creating, it can knock out something 'unique' and not entirely simple pattern based quickly, so that I can be cracking on with the other musical parts. If I have the patience, I still have the option to create midi from Jamstix and then go in and manually edit the notes before then using Jamstix kit in midi player mode. Problem is of course by tht stage I'm getting weary and am likely not to go back and do that ha ha.
Meant to say also that 'In My Old age' (not my 'Own' age, and really its real title is just 'My Old Age' but the distributor got it wrong) was recorded in a proper recording studio (Monochrome Studios) and produced by Tom Gittins (who has worked with Robert Plant and Tom also plays the lead guitar part in the song). It was recorded by a band called Rothko, which I was in c1974 and which got together again c2014 and went back in the studio to redo songs from 40+ years ago (if you search Spotify etc for 'Rothko and Mark Pritchett' you can find lots of stuff). Mark was a neighbour and songwriting collaborator of David Bowie at the time he shot to fame as Ziggy, and he later joined the short lived Mick Ronson Band when the Spiders split up. We nearly got the gig of supporting Bowies first big US tour at that time, but he got too big for little old us to get the support gig.
Mike
P.S. link to Dixie is here if interested
https://soundcloud.com/mobbing_it_up/the-night-they-drove-old-dixie-down-robbie-robertsonthe-mob |
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Azimuth
Moderator & Beta Team
Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 2131
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2022 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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| d_steinschneider wrote: | BTW, I use this YouTube video to be able to adjust Reaper's tempo map to recordings we did without a click. It requires installing SWS extensions which wasn't too difficult:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ryz7BfQnzg |
I use LCipher's tempo mapping method demonstrated in the post:
https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php?p=2221411&postcount=18
Granted it requires you to install Python and Sonic Visualizer but it is unbelievably fast once you get it up and running. It generates a MIDI tempo map which you then import into Reaper. Time signature changes can also be a bit of a pain in the a** sometimes too but I've found that to be the case with every tempo mapping method I've tried.
I did make one small change to LCipher's script because it generated crazy first bar tempos sometimes. If you want to know what I changed just ask and I'll look what it was and let you know if you'd like to try this method out. |
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mikeon_b4c
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Joined: 19 Feb 2021
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2022 4:18 am Post subject: |
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| Azimuth wrote: | | d_steinschneider wrote: | BTW, I use this YouTube video to be able to adjust Reaper's tempo map to recordings we did without a click. It requires installing SWS extensions which wasn't too difficult:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ryz7BfQnzg |
I use LCipher's tempo mapping method demonstrated in the post:
https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php?p=2221411&postcount=18
Granted it requires you to install Python and Sonic Visualizer but it is unbelievably fast once you get it up and running. It generates a MIDI tempo map which you then import into Reaper. Time signature changes can also be a bit of a pain in the a** sometimes too but I've found that to be the case with every tempo mapping method I've tried.
I did make one small change to LCipher's script because it generated crazy first bar tempos sometimes. If you want to know what I changed just ask and I'll look what it was and let you know if you'd like to try this method out. |
To quote Chuck Berry, and speaking as a musician who has to try not to get sidelined too much by trying to master DAW technical stuff:
| Quote: | That's why I go for that rock and roll music
Any old way you choose it
It's got a backbeat, you can't lose it
Any old time you use it |
The only tempo change usually/maybe is going to half-time for some bits, which Jamstix handles just fine  |
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d_steinschneider
Jam Meister
Joined: 13 Feb 2017
Posts: 78
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2022 10:03 am Post subject: |
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Everytime I watch YouTube Jamstix tutorials I pick up something I missed. I just spent a morning re-watching them and testing a few things.
I've done this about every six months. When you're back to it we should have a discussion here about how to get Jamstix to best drum for a particular song's style. |
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mikeon_b4c
Jammer
Joined: 19 Feb 2021
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2022 10:35 am Post subject: |
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| d_steinschneider wrote: | Everytime I watch YouTube Jamstix tutorials I pick up something I missed. I just spent a morning re-watching them and testing a few things.
I've done this about every six months. When you're back to it we should have a discussion here about how to get Jamstix to best drum for a particular song's style. |
Jamstix is such an interesting phenomenon that it's a shame it doesn't have a YouTuber doing for it what Reapermania does for Reaper. For this old musu though, the words of David Bowie come to mind. From memory
| Quote: | | My head hurt like a warehouse, I had no time to stare. I had to try so hard to cram so many things in there |
😬😆 |
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d_steinschneider
Jam Meister
Joined: 13 Feb 2017
Posts: 78
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2022 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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i agree it would be great if someone like Kenny Goia was doing Jamstix YouTube segments. You've given me an idea to contact him and offer to share what I know already on a Zoom session to see if he might want to dive in and then do some videos.
There are 4 1 hour videos by Jonathon Clark ("DJ Bolivia" that contain a lot of good Jamstix training content but he spends about half the time talking about different DAW's, midi and song production. I was thinking of downloading them and cutting out everything except when he is on screen with Jamstix. Even if I just shared that privately I think I need to get his permission which I'm not sure he will agree to
I've been thinking that Azimuth here on the forum should lead a Zoom call, share his screen and do Q&A and go over techniques. |
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Azimuth
Moderator & Beta Team
Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 2131
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 7:49 am Post subject: |
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| Honestly I'd love to do that but I really just do not have the time. I'll gladly try to answer any questions you want to ask if I have an answer though. |
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d_steinschneider
Jam Meister
Joined: 13 Feb 2017
Posts: 78
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 9:37 am Post subject: |
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| @Azimuth, understood, thanks as always for all your answers here on the forum! |
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mikeon_b4c
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Joined: 19 Feb 2021
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 10:11 am Post subject: |
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| d_steinschneider wrote: | i agree it would be great if someone like Kenny Goia was doing Jamstix YouTube segments. You've given me an idea to contact him and offer to share what I know already on a Zoom session to see if he might want to dive in and then do some videos.
There are 4 1 hour videos by Jonathon Clark ("DJ Bolivia" that contain a lot of good Jamstix training content but he spends about half the time talking about different DAW's, midi and song production. I was thinking of downloading them and cutting out everything except when he is on screen with Jamstix. Even if I just shared that privately I think I need to get his permission which I'm not sure he will agree to
I've been thinking that Azimuth here on the forum should lead a Zoom call, share his screen and do Q&A and go over techniques. |
Great idea about contacting Kenny - I love what he has done for those learning Reaper and to me Jamstix is the Reaper of the drum vsti world but it needs a helping hand on the tutorial front. I watched those 4 x 1 hour videos but they were too much to take in, a bit here and there, and it was jamstix 3 I think so you were left worried over whether the advice would be confusing when using jamstix 4 interface and menu system. |
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d_steinschneider
Jam Meister
Joined: 13 Feb 2017
Posts: 78
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| Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 10:59 am Post subject: |
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| mikeon_b4c wrote: |
I watched those 4 x 1 hour videos but they were too much to take in, a bit here and there, and it was jamstix 3 I think so you were left worried over whether the advice would be confusing when using jamstix 4 interface and menu system. |
I watched them about two years ago and decided to watch them last weekend at 2x speed just to see if I missed anything. I did pickup a couple of things. |
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