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genmce_1
Jammer
Joined: 21 Dec 2012
Posts: 35
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 Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:36 am Post subject: Liveloop questions: REVISED - how to setup in Reaper |
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Hi Ralph,
I have tried to revise my last post as it was so confusing to even me...
Hopefully this will be better.
I am using Reaper.
How to setup to use these features?
Is there a tutorial on using this somewhere, that I missed?
From manual -
| Quote: | | In a nutshell, this turns every part of the song into a loop and assigns it a program change number (Part 1=1, Part 2=2 etc.). Jamstix will keep playing the current part until it receives the program change number of another part. If that happens, the current part will be completed and Jamstix will then jump to the requested part. |
I have attempted this and don't have it working yet... so if liveloop is on, it should play thru intro and step to 2nd part (verse) and play until program change 3 (in my case chorus) is received and play that until another programs change is recieved? Is that the expected behavior?
| Quote: | Finally, you have the choice between parts being repeated indefinitely or following their
repetition count using the “Liveloop Advance Part” MIDI trigger key. For example: you may
have a live performance that you want to follow the set part/rep structure without you having
to MIDI trigger part changes. Simply send the ‘Advance Part’ MIDI trigger after starting the
song and the part changes occur automatically. You may suddenly wish to extend a part (i.e. a
solo or audience-involvement) and can do so by sending the ‘Advance Part’ trigger to switch to
indefinite repeat. When you’re done, send the trigger again and part changes will resume. |
This sounds way cool...
I have tried to do this... just testing sending the note I pick in the jamming settings c#0. I am on Reaper and I am sending the note to the jamstix track, i see it is received by Reaper on the jamstix track.
How do I know it's working?
Does liveloop need to be active?
Could you add some sort of indicator that liveloop advance part is holding a part?
Or is it there already?
Should I ask more specific questions?
Please help,
Thanks |
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Ralph [RZ]
Site Admin
Joined: 02 Jan 2008
Posts: 13332
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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Make sure 'Liveloop' is checked in the song sheet. When the trigger note is received, you should see a message in the Jamstix status bar and JS should change to the triggered part when the current part is finished.
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com |
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genmce_1
Jammer
Joined: 21 Dec 2012
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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Ralph,
Thanks for reply,
Ok - here is what I have setup.
Reaper 4.32,
JS 3.5.1 beta 3
I have liveloop checked on -blue- in songsheet.
I have an intro, verse1, chorus1, verse1(1), ending parts in my songsheet.
I have c#0 programmed in options > Jamming > LiveLoop Auto-Advance
I have the track (in Reaper) that JS is on, with record enabled.
I press play and drums are happening.
I press the note c#0 and I see the midi in light up on JS, however I do not see a message in the status bar and Reaper continues to play Verse1 indef.
Is JS looking for note on or note off message?
Also - I can't get JS to change parts with program change messages.
Here is a dump of my JS.ini in case I don't have a setting correct somewhere.
Liveloop trigger is = -1
Is that the note to trigger liveloop auto-advancewhich?
| Code: |
[General]
AlwaysSync=1
DataPath=c:\jamstix3\data
LastSave=1/14/2013 12:01:10 PM
Outputs=16
MIDI_Channel_Jam=0
MIDI_Channel_Control=0
WavePriority=1
AVLMRealism=800
AutoLockEvents=1
ImportMIDITiming=0
AudioInput=1
ReverseCC4=0
NeverMixdown=0
FullLog=0
LimbControl=1
AutoEditor=1
AutoAudit=1
MIDIPlayInJam=0
AutoBell=0
CompactSkin=0
AutoCrash=0
AllowTimeSigChanges=1
StereoOutputs=1
FillTriggerG=-1
FillTriggerFF=-1
PitchNumOffset=0
RandTrigger=-1
RecompTrigger=-1
LiveloopTrigger=-1
BarOffset=0
BarOffsetV=0
MIDIImportMode=0
AutoSave=0
EffectorMode=0
MIDIOutput=1
UseLOD=1
LODPreSamples=32768
LODSamples=16384
BrainOpacity=220
SongLooping=0
LoDPriority=2
LoDProcessor=0
LargeTuningRange=0
LastMIDIGroove=
AM8Rate=24
LiveloopBarJump=1
AutoRecompose=1
RecomposeBarOnly=0
IntSoundNoMIDI=0
[Input Velocity Map]
0=18
1=0
2=18
3=27
4=36
5=40
6=45
7=50
8=54
9=56
10=58
11=61
12=63
13=65
14=68
15=70
16=72
17=73
18=74
19=75
20=76
21=78
22=79
23=80
24=81
25=82
26=83
27=84
28=86
29=87
30=88
31=89
32=90
33=91
34=91
35=92
36=92
37=93
38=93
39=94
40=94
41=95
42=96
43=96
44=97
45=97
46=98
47=98
48=99
49=100
50=100
51=101
52=101
53=102
54=102
55=103
56=104
57=104
58=105
59=105
60=106
61=106
62=107
63=107
64=108
65=108
66=109
67=109
68=109
69=109
70=110
71=110
72=110
73=111
74=111
75=111
76=111
77=112
78=112
79=112
80=112
81=113
82=113
83=113
84=114
85=114
86=114
87=114
88=115
89=115
90=115
91=116
92=116
93=116
94=116
95=117
96=117
97=117
98=118
99=118
100=118
101=118
102=119
103=119
104=119
105=120
106=120
107=120
108=120
109=121
110=121
111=121
112=122
113=122
114=122
115=122
116=123
117=123
118=123
119=123
120=124
121=124
122=124
123=125
124=125
125=125
126=125
127=126
[Kit]
BurstFactor=2
BurstDuration=500
BurstRecovery=500
ArmTimePerInch=6
ArmTimeSameDrum=160
FootTimeSameDrum=140
JCOutput=7
DampMode=0
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Should I try to change that to 13 and see if I get something different.
FYI my vst folder is on a different drive e:\VSTPLUGGINS |
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genmce_1
Jammer
Joined: 21 Dec 2012
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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Just looked at it with a different controller.
Did not work.
When I looked at Options > Jamming
I hover over fill trigger (grove) status reflects "assign a Midi key to trigger groove files
I hover over Fill Trigger (free form) status reflects "Assign a MIDI key to trigger free form fills"
I hover over randomization Trigger status reflects "assign midi key to trigger drum brain randomization
I hover over Recomposition trigger status reflects "assign a midikey to trigger recompostion
*****hover over jam midi control status is assign a midi key to recomp. (not correct)
control midi chan status is "assigns a midi key to recomp" (not correct)
live loop auto-advance status is "assignes a midi key to recom" (not correct)
Don't know if that is something but is sure looks like smoking gun.
EDIT - tried a different controller - with liveloop on c0 = c1.
I say this because my novation Xstation is putting out c0 and JS is treating it like c1.
The note trigger showing on the songsheet shows c1 is intro and when I press c0 it triggers the intro.
Ok - so I set C#1 to be the Live-Loop auto advance.
When I press c#0 on my controller it toggles advance- as it should only from the wrong trigger.
I do not get any text in status showing I am in hold.
EDIT2
Ok so it worked above when I changed .ini "LiveloopTrigger" = 13
but if I changed it back to -1 it does not work.
Not sure JS is editing it's .ini file.
And not sure why gui does not reflect the .ini file.
Also no status showing live loop auto trigger is on.
Perhaps back to the status reflecting hover over item on options>jamming after re composition.
EDIT3
Gui options>jamming liveloop auto-advance
does have impact.
So .ini file "livelooptrigger = 13" and gui options>jamming auto-advance = c#1 (note 13 as reported by JS works) when they are both set to that value.
When I look at midi ox for my novation xstation keyboard is shows C#0 = note #13
Is there an offset in the .ini file I need to adjust?
EDIT4
From my tests - your midi triggers like example: "liveloop autoadvance" are looking for note on followed by note off messages with note off message data2 value > 0 and < 63, is that correct?
EDIT5
I can't get program change messages to do anything at this time.
I am sending program change #1, 2, 3 to a songsheet with 8 parts.
During playback, pc message 1, 2 or 3 does not switch between parts 1, 2, 3.
Does LiveLoop audo-advance toggle govern if program change messages will be responded to?
It seems that Note triggers are effected by toggle of Liveloop auto-advance. Meaning you can change parts, however, if auto-advance is toggled on then you are repeating part, and if it is toggled off then you don't repeat part it flows.
Is that correct?
****I'd like to requestr a different color for the text of "LIVELOOP" on the gui when liveloop auto-advance is holding - maybe RED perhaps?
Especially since the status message is only short lived.
Also - some way to show it when the song sheet is big - "Big Time Panel"
I like how the "Big Time Panel" shows the next item coming
I'd also like to ask for (since there is room on the gui) in big time,
maybe 3 parts stacked. Topmost currently playing, next down is the next up (blue) and next after that - just for reference of what is to come. Have it scroll up as parts change. Maybe even have the option of the bar timeline take the place of the bar editor when on Big Time Panel.
These only suggestions/requests from me and my experience with jamstix.
I find that when I am by myself I use the song sheet to help me keep track, however, I have to look carefully at the screen to see.
I like the big time panel, however the next part flashes too quickly for me and having the next part flash above the currently playing is kind of confusing for me.
Perhaps I should email you directly with these suggestions... to keep the clutter down on the board.
Perhaps you don't really want them?
I hope my details are clear and convey important information to you.
Thanks much |
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genmce_1
Jammer
Joined: 21 Dec 2012
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:13 am Post subject: 3.5.0 similar issues as above |
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I am running xp sp3 same Reaper as above.
I confirm the "hover over" above issue is the same in 3.5.0.
Program change 1,2,3 not changing parts in 3.5.0 when in liveloop
Also when in live loop and when out of live loop notice
the bar timeline qui refresh does not seem consistent. |
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Ralph [RZ]
Site Admin
Joined: 02 Jan 2008
Posts: 13332
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| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 10:34 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the catch on the incorrect hint messages, this will be fixed.
We'll look into the program change problem but our intention was/is to phase this out and just use note triggers.
"Auto-advance" decides whether parts are repeated endlessly until the next part change note trigger (default) or if JS will advance to the next part if the current part is over. We will add a notification message for this trigger to the status line.
The note naming difference between Novation and JS is a bit odd. We are only aware of the Yamaha/Roland convention difference, which is 2 octaves and for which there is a toggle switch in the JS3 Options.
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com |
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genmce_1
Jammer
Joined: 21 Dec 2012
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:34 am Post subject: |
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| Ralph [RZ] wrote: | Thanks for the catch on the incorrect hint messages, this will be fixed.
We'll look into the program change problem but our intention was/is to phase this out and just use note triggers.
"Auto-advance" decides whether parts are repeated endlessly until the next part change note trigger (default) or if JS will advance to the next part if the current part is over. We will add a notification message for this trigger to the status line.
The note naming difference between Novation and JS is a bit odd. We are only aware of the Yamaha/Roland convention difference, which is 2 octaves and for which there is a toggle switch in the JS3 Options. |
Thanks for the reply.
I can see many ppl would like to keep the program change, including me.
I have a couple of foot controllers, fcb1010 and a podxt live that put out program change messages by default which makes them very useful with these features of Jamstix. Please consider fixing and keeping.
I will try the toggle in JS3 options.
Any thoughts on the gui text "liveloop" turning red when liveloop is holding?
I really have a hard time telling when it's holding or not, I have to wait until it passes the switch point, then it's too late...
Also
JS is not updating the Jamstix3.ini file, for liveloop autoadvance setting.
I can manually edit the .ini but gui does not reflect note selected in the .ini file. I will test this again and confirm - if ini settings are changed.
BTW - thanks a bunch for the added midi toggle control of offset, I haven't had a chance to test it yet. I hope to get a chance today.
I am happy to help beta test - where should I put results? On a new post or in the beta thread?
Good Day Sir.
EDIT1
I am reading the manual (pg. 5 and it says
| Quote: | Liveloop Toggle
Allows you turn Liveloop mode on/off via a MIDI key. Very useful for live performances to
switch back and forth between song structure following and infinite-loop part triggering. |
Is this still in JS?
This is NOT the same as liveloop auto-advance, correct?
Where is the Liveloop Toggle set?
I don't see it on the options jamming section?
Is it a setting in the .ini?
Obviously I'm into midi control and want as much as I can get.
I just discovered we can control the brain with cc's I can't wait to map my bcr2000 to control these parts. VERY cool! |
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miden_1
Jam Meister
Joined: 15 Sep 2008
Posts: 80
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| Posted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Ralph [RZ] wrote: |
We'll look into the program change problem but our intention was/is to phase this out and just use note triggers.
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Why?
When playing a keyboard, one does nto have the time to be pressing other keys to change this, the program change is a much better method |
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miden_1
Jam Meister
Joined: 15 Sep 2008
Posts: 80
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| Posted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Ralph [RZ] wrote: |
We'll look into the program change problem but our intention was/is to phase this out and just use note triggers.
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Why?
When playing a keyboard, one does nto have the time to be pressing other keys to change this, the program change is a much better method |
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