Rayzoon Technologies LLC

[ProfRhino]

Hi Ralph, guys,
little problem in SX 3.01 :
Say I have a loop in SX from bar 9 to 16 'cause I'm working on a verse.
Jamstix always plays some erratic stuff on bar 9, no matter what I do.
If I change the loop to bar 8 to 16 and insert a measure of silence to bar 8 in jamstix all's well, bars 9 to 16 play fine.
Similar in Minihost, bar 1 always plays some random stuff.
Any hints on what I'm doing wrong ?
Cheers, Rhino

BTW, latency @ 6 ms

[Ralph [RZ]]

It sounds like the synch-in issues of older Jamstix versions. I just tested a loop in Cubase with Jamstix X2-7 and it synchs tight. Which version are you using?
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[ProfRhino]

Ralph,
I'm using 2-7 on both machines
P4-3.06 / 2 GB Ram / SX-3.01 / 2*UAD / 1 PoCo /XP Pro SP1a
Battery2 / DFHS
P4-2.0 / 1 GB Ram / MiniHost / XP Pro SP2
internal JS sounds
all legal software, no cracks & stuff

I'm not at all sure if it really is JS's fault, maybe I make some stupid mistake.

BTW, when you're talking about latency, do you mean nominal sound card latency (6ms, RME Digiface) or complete latency after PDC ?
My complete latency might be way higher because of the DSP cards.
The longest route (snare) travels through 5 UAD plugs in series which theoretically should give a complete latency of 5*6ms*2 = 60 ms.
Can't try switching the inserts off atm since I'm @ home.

Thanks for being helpful, as always,
Rhino

[Ralph [RZ]]

This isn't a latency issue because then your timing would always be "drunk". However, the additional plugin latency may play a role, trying it out without the fx plugins would be a quick way to test.

Could you send me an example CPR to support@rayzoon.com?
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[ProfRhino]

Hello Ralph,
you got mail !

Rhino

[ProfRhino]

Hi Ralph,
thanks for your constant improving of JamStix.
Any news on the DSP card issue ?
Cheers,
Rhino

[Ralph [RZ]]

[ProfRhino]

Hi Ralph,
that's exactly what I've been doing all the time.
(please compare the .cpr I sent you )
DFHS in JS don't make much sense to me because of the output routing.
My only reason for using a cumbersome library like DFHS is to be able to individually process the "mics", using my beloved UAD & PoCo DSP card plugins on group inserts.
Those plugs increase system latency by 12 ms each for the longest chain.
Example : Snare >1176 compressor>Pultec EQ>Classicverb>Drum group>Precision Limiter>Master Out>Precision Limiter, makes for a total latency of 6ms Soundcard latency + 12ms*6 , 78 ms in total.
The first bar of a loop goes crazy.
And yes, the timing is a bit shaky, too
When I switch off PluginDelayCompensation JS works as expected but then all those plugs are disabled (obviously).
Hope this helps clear up the mess a bit, please ask if I've not been specific enough.
Cheers,
Rhino

[Ralph [RZ]]

In your setup, if you are using a looped track of recorded MIDI data (recorded from JS prior maybe) instead of Jamstix, do you get the same issue?
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[ProfRhino]

PS: I should have mentioned, the exported MIDI works fine.
Atm I'm using JS's internal sounds for programming and switch to DFHS with plugs later using the MIDI track.
But it would be nice to be able to work with JS & DFHS from the start.
All the best,
Rhino

[Ralph [RZ]]

[ProfRhino]

There is no difference with JS & DFHS between real time & MIDI as long as I don't use any DSP plugs (which have to be latency compensated by SX, thus increasing overall latency as described).
To summarize, JS works fine in all respects without DSP plugs but gets more and more shaky the higher the total latency becomes.
DFHS or Battery or other software samplers on their own are not affected by this because of PDC.
Hope that helps,
Rhino

[Ralph [RZ]]

The odd thing is that it runs fine from bar 10-16 in your example, right?

Now the only difference that I can see is that Cubase doesn't know the JS events ahead of time as it does with a MIDI track and this could mess up PDC. Is there any way that you could try this with Groove Agent instead of JS (or some other plugin that generates MIDI out by itself without input)?
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[ProfRhino]

Hi Ralph,
downloading GA demo atm.
I'll keep you informed.
Cheers,
Rhino

[ProfRhino]

Hi Ralph,
sorry to bring bad news, but Groove Agent demo runs just fine, regardless of internal sounds or DFHS via external MIDI, PDC or not.
Using the exact LoopError.cpr I sent you, just added GA and bypassed JS.
Hope you'll work out something for this in the future !
Kind regards,
ProfRhino