Rayzoon Technologies LLC

[rickaitch]

Hi Ralph, I've just bought JS and I'm loving it (who wouldn't!) but I would like to be able to use it with Power Tracks.

The new version of PT (v11 build 3) now has support for the inclusion of VST/VSTI FX/instruments but there are some problems when using JS (v1.61).
Please look at this thread on the PGmusic forum for more info:

http://www.pgmusic.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=102208&an=0&page=0#Post102208

PT has been around for many years and has evolved into a great music production tool for a very reasonable price. I believe it has a user base large enough to warrant getting JS to function well with it in terms of extra business for Rayzoon.

Thanks for any consideration you can give to this

Rick

[Ralph [RZ]]

Hi Rick,
I had a look at the thread at the PG forum. I would love to help get JS going on PT11 but I'm going to need your help. The main reason is that PT11 just started to support VSTi and Jamstix uses more VST-spec resources than standard VSTi synths so Jamstix and similar plugins often reveal weaknesses in VST host implementations.

We just can't afford to put manpower right now on dealing with PT11 to essentially help them get their implementation straight or to develop a work-around on our end for specific issues. As you know, Jamstix works fine in all the major hosts so we know any issues with a Jamstix/PT11 must be PT11-issues.

Having said all that, I may be able to help identify what is happening. First off, someone stated that the MME driver in PT11 caused timing issues. That would then be a problem of the driver itself or the way the driver is used by PT11. I would first check the MME driver settings and then use the MME driver in another host (SAVIHost would work) to see if the problem persist. If it does then you have a bad driver or driver config. If not then it is a PT11 problem.

Concerning the start/stop issue: I'm not sure if I fully understand that. Are you guys saying that Jamstix' bar/beat counters are running even if PT11 is stopped?
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[rickaitch]

Thanks Ralph, I understand the difficulties and time constraints you must face and that the interfacing between JS and PT must, in the end, be a collaboration between PG music and yourselves.

This weekend I will try to work out a more definitive description of what's happening currently with JS and PT and how using different drivers affects this interaction (on my setup at least).

I'll post my findings ASAP. They may at least give you some clue as to the extent of work necessary.

Regards, Rick

[jazzmammal]

<Concerning the start/stop issue: I'm not sure if I fully understand that. Are you guys saying that Jamstix' bar/beat counters are running even if PT11 is stopped?>

Yes, exactly. This is only when trying to freejam. As soon as you open the window, JS starts playing on its own (I don't know where it's getting the tempo from, maybe the last tune I used it with?) and if you start PT11 the two are playing independently of each other. PT11 works fine with JS as a VSTi plug playing an existing midi drum track or just opening the JS window and playing around with it. I know I'm missing something simple here. In your tutorials talking about the major hosts, you refer to "input echo" or routing the input from the track being used to the output of the other track that's actually playing JS. If you can just describe in a generic way how that works, if I can't the figure it out myself, I'll shoot it off to PG support and I'm sure they can. It seems to be something in the monitor routing or something like that. I have the EMU 1820M with their Patchmix. Is it something in Patchmix I'm missing? Remember, JS is recieving the info from the source track because the velocity bar and lights are moving. I've used PT for over 2 years and in reading their forums, PT does almost everything the other hosts do but maybe this is an execption. One thing it doesn't do is midi automation for example.

Thanks, Bob

[Ralph [RZ]]

JazzMammal, please load a new Jamstix into a new PT11 project. Make sure PT11 is stopped. At that point, do the bar/beat counters of Jamstix advance?
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[jazzmammal]

Ralph, sorry I took a while been busy. Yes the bar/beat counter is running as soon as you can see the window. No sound until I loaded in a pattern, then you hear that pattern. This is true whether or not it's a new blank project or an existing midi file. JS will play the existing midi drum track just fine but the instant I loaded a rhythm it started playing one bar only at it's own tempo. Changing tempos or hitting the transport controls in PT11 has no effect. I can load different patterns and JS will play them but apparantly that's it. I really screwed up by jumping the gun about PT11. I've been so busy that all I did when I first got JS was load it into PT11 and played an existing midi just for a test. I heard it playing and thought, great it works I'll look into the details later. Your comment about incomplete VST implementation seems correct. The first 3 letters of assumption are......

Bob

[Ralph [RZ]]

If the bar/beat counter in JS is running with PT11 stopped (and JS not being in rhythm preview) then it appears as if the PT11 does not properly set the VStTimeInfo flags for host stopped/playing.
_________________
Ralph Zeuner
Rayzoon Technologies LLC
http://www.rayzoon.com

[rickaitch]

Sorry guys, I had hoped to be contributing to this as well but I've had concurrent emergencies at home and work and haven't been near the PC in a musical context since last thursday.

I'll try to join in ASAP.

Rick

[rickaitch]

Hi again, I've had a closer look and my findings are pretty much the same as jazzmammal. Mainly, it seems to be issues to do with the clock source and timing in general (when in freejam).

Sorry I couldn't come up with something more meaningful

Rick

[jazzmammal]

Finally I have time to get back to this problem of using JS with Power Tracks Pro Audio. There is now a whole thread on the PG Music forum about this. It seems the same problem exists with Groove Agent and BFD regarding the groove making part. They all will play as a sound module with an existing midi track but can't create something new. PG tech support agrees there is something not implemented properly and is looking into it. At least Jamstix has found a new audience, there is a lot of interest there about it. For now, I dug up my free copy of Sonar LE and will see how that works.

Bob

[jazzmammal]

I just received this from PG Music support:

<We apologize for for the long delay. Thanks for explaining the issue so clearly. We are unable to get the Groove Librarian in BF Drums and "Free Jam" in Jamstix working properly with the current version of PowerTracks Pro Audio. This issue has been brought to the attention of our developers. Unfortunately PowerTracks is missing some features that are required by the host program for the groove generation (ie Free jam mode) in these VSTi plugins to work the way they are meant to.>

It looks like thats it for Power Tracks for now. Maybe this will be addressed in the next version.

Bob

[rickaitch]

Thanks for the update jazzmammal. I was pleased that PG Music had the humility to admit that PT11 was lacking in its VSTI implementation. It's much easier to say that the other guy is wrong

Hopefully, a future patch for PT11 will fix it.

Rick
_________________
Qualifications are no bar to stupidity.